Hi everyone!

I am programing VUO FFGL plugins for an audiovisual project. We have multiple decks on Resolume Arena 7 that contains video files and Vuo FFGL plugins. And all these media files are triggered by an I-Pad using MIDI protocol. There are 2 problems that I would like to ask about;

1- When I trigger Vuo FFGL plugins there is always latency in the first trigger. When it is triggered once, it starts without latency in the following triggers. 2- When I switch between decks, I have the same latency problem. As I tested on Resolume, Arena 7 the native Resolume FFGL plugins and the plugins that I purchased from Juice-Bar does not have any latency when I trigger them.

Is there something missing in my Vuo comps/plugins that causes the latency? Or is it something that I can fix with Resolume settings?

Thank you very much for reading my post. Have a nice day!

Here are the Vuo comps and the FFGL plugins I programmed: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/mvwtc4hp3u696b1/AACVdMmPWiALYTR630ddox_6a?dl=0

Comments

Hi I just opened one of your

video piglet's picture
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Hi I just opened one of your compositions and I notice that you used both "Fire on Display Refresh" and "Fire on Start".

You don't need to use these in plugins and the documentation implies that it's best not to.

Just draw a line from the "time" parameter if you want steady fire and use "allow first event" if you only want it to fire at the start. Press the shift key if you need to make fire lines instead of value lines.

So try this and you might notice an improvement.

I've made a lot of plugins for Resolume 6 and haven't noticed any latency issues, however I haven't triggered them by midi via an ipad so I can't comment on that. I will say that it does take significantly longer for Resolume to open if you use a lot of vuo plugins, so I recommend only keeping the plugins in the folder that you actually use.

hope that helps

ps: I also have a question for you: how do you make a triangle layer? Must be easy but i'm weirdly stuck on it.

Hi!

vidbeat's picture
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Hi! Sorry for my late reply and thank you very much for your feedback. I already tested what you wrote to me, it got better but, still comparing to the native Resolume FFGL plugins the Vuo FFGL plugins have some latency when you trigger them. As I wrote before, once when they are triggered they work perfectly but when you switch between decks and trigger them for the first time the latency problem occurs.

Anyway thanks for the great tips. I am a fresh Vuo user and still trying to learn the system. By the way, can you send me how will you use allow first event node, with one of my compositions that I shared on the post? Would be great to check if I am on the right path or not.

About the triangles, I just saw that Jean Marie replied 3 alternatives. Mine choice will be the Quad layer too.

Have a nice Sunday!

Hi I just jammed for a while

video piglet's picture
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Hi I just jammed for a while with your files - I installed the gridblobs, icosa cell and technodrome plugins to Resolume and then mapped them to midi. I'm using Resolume 6.0.1 and I started a new composition and jumped between the tabs. I mapped the parameters to a regular midi controller. I didn't find any latency. The midi sliders all worked as expected.

However.... the Gridblobs plug crashes my Resolume when you push it around!!!!!!! I haven't seen vuo plugs misbehave like this so far, so I spent a while trying to figure it out. I'm not sure why it's crashing. I deleted half the vuo file and installed another version with minimal paramaters - and then it worked properly. I suspect that the Grid Line Object node is receiving too many simultaneous triggers and this is somehow causing the crash, but I'm not sure. Anyway, this could possibly be related to what you're describing with the latency, but maybe it's something completely different.

It occurs to me your latency problem may be with Resolume and your controller. Have you checked all the extra midi information that appears in the Resolume "shortcuts" tab when you edit midi codes? If you haven't checked already you should examine these extra parameters and compare them to the other Resolume mid controls that you say do work without latency. Possibly the ipad also has similar midi options that need to be correct. I don't think my version of Resolume has a "soft pickup" option but you might want to look out for that as it could plausibly create a latency effect. You also want to check whether the midi is sending "feedback" ie midi information back to the controller, which you probably don't want.

Hi again,

vidbeat's picture
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Hi again, I just made a short screen recording to show you the triggering issue on Resolume7. When I recorded the video I had only one Vuo FFGL plugin inside the Free Frame plugins folder. Also, I made the changes that you recommended to me inside the Vuo composition. You can find the screen recording and the Vuo composition in the link below. Thank you so much for your help, have a nice Sunday!

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/chwswqbdnonze37/AABT1hfXNew4GC6-F8H3cHMZa?dl=0

Hi I just watched your video.

video piglet's picture
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Hi I just watched your video.

Firstly seems like the trigger problem is happening when you use the mouse so obviously not related to midi control.

Secondly, the vuo plugins are much much bigger than the native plugins - if you look at the file size they are often around 10mb - this is because the entire vuo library is packaged in with the plug. In comparison the Resolume fx are tiny, in the folder you can see that some of the bundles are around 50kb. I would imagine that lines and gradient are some of the simplest processes. Load a complicated (native resolume) effect with lots of animated parameters etc and you will almost certainly notice a lag as well. Basically I suspect you're up against the limitations of your processing power. I suspect you need a much faster GPU in order to launch those plugins without a lag.

Obviously it depends on what you are using this for but personally I don't find a bit of trigger latency a problem in my live shows. I have Resolume set to trigger on beat (etc) and I tend to crossfade between layers and clips. So abrupt jumps like that don't happen. Also I guess I'm mostly playing in clubs and bars and dropped frames now and then are totally ok.

Hi,

vidbeat's picture
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Hi,

Yes, you are right! The latency problem is related to the size of the Vuo plugins. Also, the complexity of the plugin causes latency too.

I am using a 2019, 16-inch MacbookPro with 2,3 GHz 8-Core Intel Core i9, 32 GB Memory, and AMD Radeon Pro 5500M 8 GB, Intel UHD Graphics 630 1536 MB graphic card.

Actually, this amount of latency is OK when you are VJing but in this case, I am programming these FFGL plugins for a musician who performs AV shows that contains lots of percussive sounds that need to be triggered with the visuals instantly.

By the way, the Vuo team also works on this issue. Also, I will share videos if I make some progress about it. Hope it will be solved soon.

I will share more compositions soon. It would be great to have your feedback.

Thank you very much for spending your time!

Hi, Motus Lumina. Sorry for

jstrecker's picture
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Hi, Motus Lumina. Sorry for the delay in answering. Our team spent some time checking where exactly the slowness is coming from and considering possible solutions.

When you trigger a Vuo FFGL plugin for the first time, the Vuo composition starts up. It takes a moment before the composition is ready to display output. That is where the latency happens.

Unfortunately there's no simple switch you can flip to fix the latency. Since videopiglet's solution of crossfades wouldn't work for your situation, your best bet would be to change how you're triggering the Vuo plugins. Since the latency happens when starting the Vuo composition, the goal here would be to keep the composition running for the duration of the song/scene. Instead of switching between the Vuo plugin and other clips, leave the Vuo plugin active the whole time and use MIDI events to control the Vuo plugin's parameters.

To actually fix this problem, we'll need to modify the startup sequence for Vuo FFGL plugins. Possibly we can cut out some steps that aren't needed for FFGL, or otherwise speed up this section. If not, we may need to discuss with the Resolume developers how best to start the Vuo composition running in advance, before it's triggered.

Hi again,

vidbeat's picture
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Hi again,

Thank you very much for your reply. I hope you can manage to speed up the startup process soon. Also great to hear that you will discuss the problem with the Resolume crew.

I will inform you if we have some progress on this topic. By the way, we are working on some cool FFGL plugins made with Vuo. We will share them soon for testing.

Thanks for your support. All our best!

Just another thought - A

video piglet's picture
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Just another thought - A resolume scene can hold a hundred clips or more, so it seems unlikely you would need to change scenes during your show. As long as the scene is "warmed up" by previewing every clip (which can be done column by column ~30seconds total) the trigger lag will never become an issue.